Ep. 02: WTA and ATP Finals Recap

Alvin Owusu (00:01.728)
Welcome friends to Best of Three. I'm Alvin. This is, I'm Alvin. This is Matt.

Matt (00:04.379)
Yes, yes and hello.

Matt, yes, hello. We're here, we're here. I'm very well, I'm very well. We have things to talk about, so I'm super well.

Alvin Owusu (00:10.21)
Are you well?

That's good. Yeah. I really look forward to these. This is our space to talk that shit and we got some shit to talk. So I feel good about being here. Yeah. How are you before we get into it? Yeah.

Matt (00:20.625)
Yep. It's happening today.

I'm good, I'm good. You know, we talked about it in another session. I feel like I'm starting to really feel the calendar year start to swirl down the calendar year drain. feel like new things are coming. It's like I'm starting to think about next year. And.

Alvin Owusu (00:45.654)
Yeah, yeah. And as we come up on Thanksgiving, we still have like a full six week sprint left in 2024. But then also 2025 is like not gonna wait for anybody. So that's where we are.

Matt (00:53.83)
Yes.

Matt (00:57.863)
Nope, We're gonna catch that bus. We're gonna catch that 2025 bus as soon as we can. Yep.

Alvin Owusu (01:04.994)
We are, we are. But anyways, we're here. The weather outside is weather. Tennis is all around us and I love it. We're coming here live in the middle of just post-Billie Jean King Cup right after, or also in the middle of Men's Davis Cup. We'll talk about those two things probably in the next episode, right? Kind of talk about them together, team tennis. I'm so into it.

Matt (01:10.843)
Ha ha ha ha ha ha.

Matt (01:34.695)
It seems so fun, doesn't it? It's just like the Pro Bowl, but better. Do know what I mean? Nobody takes the Pro Bowl seriously, but there's bragging rights on Billie Jean. Like the Cups. It's like a mini Olympics every year.

Alvin Owusu (01:34.774)
Like, my goodness.

Alvin Owusu (01:43.53)
Yeah!

Alvin Owusu (01:53.953)
Yeah.

And they have their history, like each individual event has their own history and like now they're being played kind of simultaneously at the same location. And it's, I started watching it and this is like, full disclosure, I never watched either prior to this year. But I started watching, kind of peeking in and now like I'm into it. Like I'm into it.

Matt (02:11.909)
Night.

Matt (02:17.657)
Alvin, it a thing? Is it cup season? Is it cup season? It's cup season. It's hardware season. Cup season. We're gonna get back to it. We're gonna put that in the parking lot, but it's gonna be called something and it's a season.

Alvin Owusu (02:22.186)
Ooh, it's cup season. It is cup season. It's hardware season.

Yeah, it's, love, you know, I love a swing. I love a season. This is going to be cup seeking. I'm putting this in my notes as we speak.

Matt (02:37.602)
Exactly. hardware hardware cup cup swing hardware swing. We'll figure it out. It's going to it's going to be a thing.

Alvin Owusu (02:45.076)
Yeah, I like it. But that's for another time, hopefully next week. But today we've got a really nice lineup for the people. We're gonna start with just kind of going over what happened in the last week or so, the last time you and I got together. were, think in the semi-finals-ish of the WTA finals, which was...

Matt (03:08.923)
Yep, were watching Scores Live.

Alvin Owusu (03:11.478)
We were watching scores live. Yep, were, I think we were recording during the semi-finals, Cocoa Golf versus our lady, Svalinka. And Cocoa did pull out that match and then ultimately won the event and she got paid.

Matt (03:28.411)
Yeah, let's talk about that. Yeah, let's talk about that. Let's talk about that.

Alvin Owusu (03:29.954)
$4.8 million.

What are you, are you, what are you, okay, let's, let's, where do we even start with this? Right? So I, I watched a good bit of this event, right? And the, the thing that really interests me about the women's tour right now, which is, you know, I think very much so on display at this event is that you take out your, you take out arena and you take out, EGA and it feels like, like those feel like the definite

Matt (03:44.711)
Mm-hmm.

Matt (04:02.908)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (04:05.046)
two, one and two in whatever order, you know, we have this year versus last year. But then three through eight is no joke. Like it's no joke. And I think Coco winning it is really, you know, it's really a testament to what I believe is her biggest strength is which Coco has probably the highest floor of all these players. Like on her worst day.

Matt (04:15.269)
for sure. Yeah.

Matt (04:32.197)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Alvin Owusu (04:35.092)
she's going to bring number three in the world energy. And if one and two aren't where they need to be, she will take them down.

Matt (04:39.407)
yeah.

Matt (04:44.761)
Absolutely. And I think one of the things that we've talked about when we're not doing this is just that Eka gets, she can get beat. She gets, she can get beat. think there was a time where I'd be like, you can't beat her. think that she is, I don't think she's in that three year, the end of that three year run that you, that you talk about. But I also, but I also think, let's see what happens when she gets a new coach, which she got.

Alvin Owusu (05:05.858)
Ooooo

Alvin Owusu (05:14.304)
Right. Right.

Matt (05:14.681)
So that could be just what she needed to be the absolute terminator that she was. But I also think Arena is not messing around. I think, just to come back to it and get it done, one and two can lose. It's awesome. We're not talking about Federer and Nadal and...

know Novak like yeah exactly like like people can lose over here but I mean you look at Pagula and I mean yeah I think I think top 10 is is dangerous it's real dangerous

Alvin Owusu (05:37.932)
Djokovic. Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (05:47.68)
It's dangerous and that's what makes it so awesome right now. I try not to look too much or read too much into, what happens at the end of the year? People are in different places for a lot of different reasons. The women leave New York after the open and then they pop up in Asia and there's a couple of events there and then Top 8 had, they went and kind of double-tracked went to...

Matt (05:50.597)
Yeah. Yeah.

Matt (06:04.411)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (06:16.128)
Went to Saudi Arabia. so what you're looking at is a lot of, a lot of players who are, think at different, who are handling this part of the year differently from one another. So Ega goes on a break, right? She goes on a break, tries to get, you know, tries to get some work done. Shows up in Riyadh. Hasn't played a match in a while. I don't think she had played a match before, like since the U S open. And so.

Matt (06:28.422)
Yeah.

Matt (06:43.591)
Yeah, I don't think so.

Alvin Owusu (06:45.874)
you know, unlikely to finish the year number one. So she gets into it like, all right, let's just let's just get after it and see what we got. Try to take from it what you can. And, you know, she she played well enough, but, did not did not qualify for the for the for the finals, the top four. But then she takes that same energy and goes into, you know, heads out to Malaga. Is it Malaga or Malaga? I've always.

I never really get her. I think it's Malaga for Billie Jean King Cup and now she's rolling, right?

Matt (07:21.735)
Yeah, the end of the year is a weird thing.

Alvin Owusu (07:25.6)
It is, it is. It's like, what are we, are we here? Are we happy to be here? We're gonna play out the side and then take the money and then head to the Maldives? Or are we actually trying to win this thing? Do we have the energy to win this thing? Like it's not the best time of year for an end of year championships when you're like, know, yeah, they start the next season in like this year.

Matt (07:47.077)
So tired.

Alvin Owusu (07:53.672)
So it's a hard ask. So you have to, think you have to take it all with a grain of salt, the results, but kind of take what you can and.

Matt (07:58.661)
Yeah. Yeah. It's super interesting. And I think, I think going back to the idea of like huge amount of money for cocoa, that, that, what that means is like,

Alvin Owusu (08:09.867)
Yeah.

Matt (08:13.843)
She's going big like it's she's going big. I think that the top 10 is going big and you know We always used to say like any any given fortnight especially on the WTA tour You don't know what's gonna happen and I think with this top 10 that we're finishing with and going into next year with assuming Everybody stays healthy or whatever like you don't know what's gonna happen and that's a big thing and whoever whoever Any 10 of these people are about to get big money big tournaments big endorsements big big everything

Alvin Owusu (08:24.695)
right.

Alvin Owusu (08:41.174)
Yeah.

Matt (08:42.177)
And I think what it means is like next year's gonna be crazy.

Alvin Owusu (08:46.824)
Next year is going to be crazy. it's, I'm, I'm like so excited to see what happens like once we get to Australia.

Matt (08:51.483)
Yeah. And like, and who, and who is going to tear up the chart? Like, who do we not know? Like you're like, you know, if you look at top 10, like Paulini, Zang, like these people shot up the chart. They shot up the chart. Also Danielle Collins is like, I'm not done. So like, she's got nothing to lose. She's going to kill it.

Alvin Owusu (09:09.428)
Right, and then then like, Barbara, Barbara's good to like just kind of sneak a grand slam every once in a while, like, you know she can do it, she's done it twice.

Matt (09:18.372)
She's she's thinking about which one she's gonna shock the hell out of me

Alvin Owusu (09:25.038)
And you know, just kind of like thinking about this, Barbara has won two Grand Slams now in her career. That's on the women's side. that's, that is a Hall of Fame career. That's a Hall of Fame career. Like you were, it's like a legitimate conversation. I don't think anyone with two Grand Slams is not in the Hall of Fame. I'm gonna.

Matt (09:35.491)
That's like two more than most of them. Yeah. yeah.

Matt (09:45.007)
Yeah, no, she definitely like has very quietly and in a super unassuming way, like made her way into history and everybody's like, who? And I'm just saying, watch out. The last thing I want to say about the tour and what it all means and the big money and all of that, Emma Navarro, I'm going to be really curious to see if she's a,

what archetype she fits. Is she gonna stay there? Is she gonna fall off? Is she gonna tear, like, rise up? Like, I think she's real... She's a big question mark for me, like, in a good way. Like, I'm super curious what she's about to do.

Alvin Owusu (10:21.928)
Let me push on that a little bit. Because I think she is... I have thoughts. But do you... What do you think is going to happen? Like, do you think she has the potential to crack into that top four and make a run at a slam?

Matt (10:39.459)
I think she's going to completely drop off or I think she's going to stay where she is in the top 10.

Alvin Owusu (10:48.118)
So you think this is her ceiling.

Matt (10:50.747)
I think it's her ceiling this year. don't think she's going where I think she's about to have a long career. But I don't see, don't, I mean maybe she's gonna rope a dope arena one day, but I don't think, I think we are either gonna lose track of Emma or she is going to be top 10 next year. That's my prediction.

Alvin Owusu (10:53.791)
Okay.

Alvin Owusu (10:59.34)
Okay.

Alvin Owusu (11:06.978)
Mm-hmm.

Alvin Owusu (11:15.946)
Okay. I feel, I feel, I feel somewhat similar in that like her, her baseline probably is top 10. If you hold other things like constant, like, okay. She finished up the year at, what was she at eight? No, she's eight. Okay. So I guess the easy way to start is like, does anyone else out of the top eight pass her?

Matt (11:30.32)
Yeah.

Matt (11:35.227)
Yeah, she's

Alvin Owusu (11:45.414)
with a, you know, with, with health and, or whatever, like does Carolina Mojova play a full season and then like sneak past Emma Navarro? Does, does Naomi come back and like reassert herself? Does Mira Andreeva have a, you know, grow up and-

Matt (11:51.439)
I think, I think...

Matt (12:00.761)
Is it?

These are all important questions. Also, like, I don't know about I don't know a lot about Jasmine and I don't I don't think she's messing around either. So I think I think it's I think this I, you know, kind of kind of rounding out the WTA finals conversation in general, like I think I think I have no idea what's going to happen. And like last year, it's like, well, Arena and Rebecca and and eager are going to whoop everybody. And that's not that's not what's going to happen this time. That's not what's going to happen.

Alvin Owusu (12:11.316)
Right.

Alvin Owusu (12:29.698)
Right. Yeah, it's exciting stuff. And I think, you know, in a couple of weeks after everything kind of shuts down, we'll do a proper WTA year in review and 2025 preview and kind of, you know, maybe peel this onion a little bit further. But I think all in all, I think it was a, I enjoyed watching the event. Cocoa winning it was, I mean, take the money aside, it was not nothing. So I think.

Matt (12:58.363)
Well, she's not in debt anymore. What was it? What was like the headline?

Alvin Owusu (13:00.546)
no, yeah, the, was it a live stream she was on in the comment section? was like, she's not, she could pay off some of her loans or get out of debt. And it's like, she's like, I'm 19. I I didn't go to college. I don't have any debt.

Matt (13:12.453)
Well, we're going to talk about her lack of debt and sponsorships a little later in material things when we talk about WTA and a certain watch manufacturer. But for now, I think we also should probably talk about the ATP finals recap.

Alvin Owusu (13:20.415)
I like that.

Alvin Owusu (13:26.465)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (13:31.605)
Yeah.

Matt (13:34.459)
Hit me Alvin.

Alvin Owusu (13:36.384)
ATV finals also happened.

Matt (13:39.195)
They did.

Alvin Owusu (13:41.036)
Did you get a chance to watch much?

Matt (13:42.533)
I didn't see a lot of it. I didn't see a lot of it. I skew women and I skew choked out by my children. So.

Alvin Owusu (13:50.05)
Yeah, no, that's fair. I was very, very beneficial of the time, the time between here and Turin, and I got a chance to watch a decent amount of it. From my perspective right now, so obviously Jannik Sinner won the event. He also made $4.8 million, so you know.

Matt (13:56.699)
Mm-hmm.

Matt (14:00.07)
yeah.

Matt (14:12.231)
So that's another thing that's interesting about all of this. The bag was the same.

Alvin Owusu (14:18.146)
The bag was the same. Yeah, the bag was the same. And they were in different locations, right? So I think it just kind of, I think that was kind of the big kicker with the Saudi investment into the WTA finals. It was like, okay, we're gonna bring parity in the purses between the players. So that is a net positive, so all good. Yeah, my kind of big takeaway is from the event and I don't wanna dwell too much on it because

Matt (14:38.427)
Yeah, it's great. It's a great thing.

Alvin Owusu (14:47.21)
I think this is kind of like, we've kind of settled into like tears on the men's side. there's, so Yannick Center is, he is almost like the litmus right now. He is the metronome of the tour. Like he, this guy doesn't have bad days. Like he's very Novak in the way that he can get on the bassline and just lock it down.

Matt (14:52.667)
Yeah, talk to me about that.

Matt (15:00.863)
Mm-hmm. He's the new guy.

Alvin Owusu (15:14.59)
and hit the piss out of the ball, but also move so well.

Matt (15:18.627)
His mental game feels really strong also. Like I think the mechanics and the kind of like the physical mechanics, you can speak to it a lot better. like as a more, as a non-player, like watching him, he's an ice cube. Like I just like, he is not a mercurial guy. Like I think he's, and those type of people succeed. Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (15:34.881)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (15:41.194)
Yeah, and they're consistent and that's exactly what he is. Like he has been runaway player of the year outside of being, you know, finishing the year number one, winning two Grand Slams.

Matt (15:47.205)
for sure. Everybody knows who he is but the idea of like where he is now like I would a year or two ago now. A year ago. Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (15:55.328)
Right. Well, a year ago, he hadn't won a Grand Slam yet. He was like, it was interesting. This time last year is where he, he takes down, takes down Novak at the, at the ATP finals and then loses to him. Like he beats him in the round robin loses to him in the, in the, in the semis or the finals of the actual event. And then comes back, beats him in Davis cup, like two weeks later. like that was the.

Matt (16:21.798)
Mm-hmm.

Alvin Owusu (16:24.854)
this dude is here, what's he gonna do in 2024? And then he won the Australian Open, beating Novak in the semi. So like, or maybe around the six, not quarters, but.

Matt (16:28.101)
Yeah. Yeah.

It's a, so I don't, I don't want to get too like crazy about it, but I mean, there's definitely the guard is slowly changing. And I think that's one of the big things to think about when we're talking about the finals here. Like there's, there is an, an era coming in.

Alvin Owusu (16:50.082)
Yeah, and that's the thing that I... It's interesting, like, you know, we talked about it previously with the women how it's so exciting because the top 10 is, they're all there for the fight, right? They're all there for the fight. But when I look at the men's side, I'm like, okay, I kind of know what I'm going to get. Like, Janik's going to show up. He's going to show up and he's going to play at a... between a level of eight and a half and 9.75.

Matt (17:02.446)
yeah.

Matt (17:10.716)
Mm-hmm.

Alvin Owusu (17:19.276)
pretty much all the time, right? if he, yeah, vast majority of the time, and if he does, the only person that really can match him and then supersede him right now is Carlos Alcaraz. But Alcaraz sometimes, eh, sometimes he just doesn't, right, yeah.

Matt (17:20.111)
Yeah, yeah, and that's gonna be enough a lot of the time.

Matt (17:39.257)
Alcaraz, Alcaraz sometimes. Can you just stop there? That's his new name, Alcaraz sometimes.

Alvin Owusu (17:44.81)
Yeah, Alcranis sometimes. So you put these two guys in the, in the tier by themselves, right? And then you got the rest of them, the, the Zverevs and the Medvedevs and the Fritz, D-Minor. Like, we'll, we'll take, we'll leave Djokovic out of this conversation for now because I don't know where he is.

Matt (18:01.647)
Yeah, he's still a question mark. I he might show up and be like, I feel much better. I got all kinds of holistic homeopathic infusions and now I'm ready to go.

Alvin Owusu (18:11.486)
Yeah. Or he just wants to like he pops up in Melbourne. He's like, you know what? I've won this tournament a lot. I'd like to win it again. And, know, but you know, has Father Time is undefeated. So at some point,

Matt (18:16.699)
Yeah.

It happens. Well, well, he also he's number seven.

Alvin Owusu (18:25.684)
Yeah, yeah, and he didn't play in the tour finals. He just opted out.

Matt (18:29.573)
So talk to me about Taylor Fritz for a second.

Alvin Owusu (18:35.018)
what are we? Yeah, let's talk about Taylor. Let's talk about Taylor. Taylor Fritz is our US number one, right? We like Taylor. He's the best we've got and I think getting to the finals of the US Open was huge for him, kind of breaking through that ceiling. yeah, and then he gets to, you know, we get to Turin, he qualifies for the finals and he ends Vera of like,

Matt (18:38.503)
Let's talk about Taylor Fritz for a second.

We like Taylor.

Matt (18:50.905)
Yep. It's great.

Alvin Owusu (19:03.948)
They've played a few times this year, especially in the back half of the year. And he's found something where he can, he can beat Zverev and Zverev.

Matt (19:12.583)
Well, that's the thing also, these like rankings matter, all these things we're talking about, but those matchups, like you and me and Dasef talk about that sometimes, like sometimes those matchups will disrupt an entire table at a grand slam. It's just like, it's just changing.

Alvin Owusu (19:25.29)
Yeah, yeah, and it's really like, you know, how does the draw, how does the draw unfold? Like, and then you find Taylor Fritz in the, in a, in a final. And I think that's gonna be, I think that's the story kind of moving towards moving into next year is that between those guys that are ranked, you know, call it three through eight, I think it's a grab bag of like, who's gonna be the one that doesn't.

Matt (19:35.505)
Yeah.

Matt (19:50.683)
Mm-hmm.

Alvin Owusu (19:54.346)
end up having to go through Alcaraz and or Center and then that person can can get to the final of a Grand Slam.

Matt (19:57.743)
Yeah. Well, there's a whole bunch of dudes who don't have a Grand Slam on that tour because of the era we just lived through. we were just talking about Babs and she's one of these random chicks with a, and I mean that respectfully, with a Grand Slam. And there's not random dudes with Grand Slams. That's just not how things have gone.

Alvin Owusu (20:08.214)
right.

Alvin Owusu (20:21.694)
Yeah, it doesn't, it hasn't worked that way. Like you literally have to like, one, a Grand Slam won't fall in your lap. And I think, I think, I actually think, you know, the Fritz counterpart here is Alexander Zverev where he, he can do, I mean, I think he's currently ranked number two in the world, but he can, he can do everything that gets himself in a position to get to the semis or the finals of a Grand Slam, but he...

Matt (20:34.833)
Mm-hmm.

Matt (20:40.689)
Yeah, I think he's real high up. Yeah, he is.

Matt (20:46.833)
to do it.

Alvin Owusu (20:50.964)
It's funny how he has to go take it and his game style actually isn't one that screams go take it. It's more of I'm going to be here and if you drop it, I'll catch it, but I'm not going to go take it. And I think that's the, that is the ceiling that he has bumped into where

center and Carlos will just go take it.

Matt (21:16.233)
yeah, mean I, yeah, mean Carlos sometimes unless he's all the time because if it's all the time Carlos, you're not getting out of there, he's taking it. So let me ask you a question though, his consistency or lack thereof, like what do you, is it just age, is it just any number of things?

Alvin Owusu (21:27.772)
all the time, Carlos is a gift. He is a gift.

Alvin Owusu (21:41.89)
Watching Carlos over the last three, let's call it three years, he has the ability to do the incredible. And I think that there is, that's what makes him very difficult to play for a lot of players, because he can come up with some things and some places that you just, know, like, whoa, I don't have an answer for that. And he also is probably the best, if not one of the best two movers, like Speedwise on the tour right now.

So his ability to cover the court and then hit shots, like hit penetrating shots, hurting shots from anywhere in the court, that's the Carlos magic. But sometimes he won't do the boring stuff, which is like on my worst day, how do I get through a match easily? Because most matches are won by people not playing their best tennis. That's kind of what it comes down to.

Matt (22:25.703)
Mmm.

Matt (22:35.345)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Alvin Owusu (22:36.658)
And I think his ceiling, pardon me, his ceiling is the highest, but his floor is definitely lower than centers in my opinion. And that's why we get more variability in his results. Like he can, I mean, he won, managed to put together back to back grand slams in the middle of the summer on two different surfaces. Like that's cool. That's yeah, well, you know, but then also, well then like flake off and not be able to.

Matt (22:44.199)
Yeah.

Matt (22:47.633)
Yeah.

Matt (22:55.877)
Yeah, yeah, I haven't done that yet. Yeah, yeah. So something.

Alvin Owusu (23:05.676)
put it together in a warmup event for whatever reason.

Matt (23:09.255)
Yeah. One of these days we're going to talk about, about Carlos's personal life in a funny way, because I think people all think he's doing things under NDAs with other nice ladies. And anyway, we'll, get there one day. One of the things I wanted to bring up, was I'm looking at the charts, right? I'm looking at the charts. Taylor Fritz is 27 years old. He's number four. He's 30. He's hungry. He's hungry.

Alvin Owusu (23:32.758)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Matt (23:37.797)
He's hungry. I like Taylor. watched, I watched that show on the Netflix. Nice guy. He's got his kid. He's seeing, I like him. He's willing. He's willing to sacrifice his body to make a point in his hometown. said from here on out, I see Taylor. see him. Daniel Medvedev is number five. He is 28 years old. They've got the same number of points. And I think Medvedev will do anything to win.

Alvin Owusu (23:38.092)
Sounds weird.

Alvin Owusu (23:42.103)
Yep.

Alvin Owusu (23:53.419)
Okay.

Matt (24:06.823)
And I think in a world where it's real hard to get your hands on a Grand Slam, I'm always going to pick Medvedev over Taylor in reality.

not because I want to. that make sense? And like, I think that'll be interesting. It's just, I just don't think. And after, and if you look at the charts and the points, there's a big drop off after Medvedev. So for me, like right now, today, right this second, like the top five is what matters.

Alvin Owusu (24:22.804)
No, it does.

Alvin Owusu (24:38.602)
Yeah, I feel if you again, if we need to put the asterisk next to Novak's name and take him out of the conversation, I there's I'm gonna even even though Taylor is ranked currently ahead of Daniil, I'm gonna put Daniil ahead of Yeah, I'm gonna put Daniil ahead of him in the could this person win a grand slam? Well, also, he's done it too. Let's let's put that out there. He has done it. He won the US Open in 20.

Matt (24:45.99)
Mm-hmm.

Matt (24:54.267)
I mean, buy out by a hair.

Matt (25:05.723)
Mm-hmm.

Alvin Owusu (25:08.194)
2019, 2018, whatever, 19, 20, 21, I don't remember when it was. But he did win the US Open, won Novak, I guess that had to be 21, Yeah, 21. And he's been to a lot of finals. he's lost on account of some heroic events in a lot of those finals. So he's shown that he can do it. And under the right circumstance, he will get it done.

Matt (25:08.807)
Yeah.

Matt (25:17.862)
Right.

Matt (25:22.299)
He sure has.

Matt (25:28.315)
Bye.

Alvin Owusu (25:37.814)
but I don't see it out of any of the rest of these guys. Like Casper, Rublev.

Matt (25:41.795)
No, and I'm scrolling down. I'm scrolling down. We love Tommy Paul. We love Frank. We love Frank T. We want to see Belden Shelton do things, but they're just way down there right now. I hope that changes. I'd like to see that change.

Alvin Owusu (25:52.586)
Yeah, of course.

Alvin Owusu (25:58.05)
Yeah, just have, from what we've seen, today we are third week of November, with the information presently available, I just don't see it. But, know, kind of one of the last things I want to talk about was the actual final match in the ATP finals. We had a rematch of Fritz versus Sinner for the second time in the event.

Matt (26:01.073)
with the information we have now.

Matt (26:08.295)
Yeah.

Matt (26:21.093)
yeah.

Alvin Owusu (26:23.816)
third time in the last, I guess they played in the finals of the US Open as well. It's really interesting watching that matchup because, and you hear this a lot, they do a lot of the same things. Like they both wanna just bang from the back of the court and they can both do it off both wings, but at some given point.

Matt (26:28.103)
Mm-hmm.

Matt (26:37.382)
Mmm.

Alvin Owusu (26:48.662)
Taylor's just a little bit too slow to cover up a misstep. So, and I'll get a little technical, a little more technical about it. They can both go, you know, straight line to straight line, backhand to backhand, and then at some point, Yannick has the ability to get his backhand to go over the sideline, right? Cut off the court a little bit, and Taylor doesn't have the ability to create that shape. So as soon as Taylor's ball quality drops just enough,

Matt (26:53.149)
Mmm. Got it.

Matt (27:09.573)
Mm-hmm.

Alvin Owusu (27:17.388)
for Yannick to get around one and pull him off the court. We're starting to see two balls later, it's curtains for Taylor. As soon as he gets behind that rally, he can't really recover, because he just doesn't have that height, that next gear of movement, of athleticism that Yannick and Carlos have.

Matt (27:25.851)
Mm-hmm.

Matt (27:34.811)
Well, that's what they talk about with the great. Sorry. That's what they talk about with the greats is like, it's that, that other gear. And I haven't Tommy or not. Taylor. Taylor does not necessarily. I haven't seen it and he's 27.

Alvin Owusu (27:42.187)
Yeah. Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (27:49.024)
Yeah, he's a tall guy. He's a tall guy, they're all kind of tall, but that's what makes, you know, that's the difference between really good and special. Everyone's got to be tall, but tall and fast, like, that's...

Matt (28:04.061)
You have to be a lot of things. And that's why Medvedev is such a ridiculous thing, because he is fast and he's long. So yeah, mean, the ATP finals are very exciting stuff. Should be interesting next year. I'm hoping to see some variability in different people coming up and coming down.

Alvin Owusu (28:11.478)
He's very long.

Alvin Owusu (28:22.818)
Yeah, same, I just don't see it coming. I just feel like next year's gonna be, next year's gonna be, it's gonna be chalk. I could see Yannick and Carlos again winning all the Grand Slams. It could be two two, it could be four, a three one split, I don't know.

Matt (28:25.615)
You think it's gonna be pretty static.

Matt (28:43.011)
It could be worse. It could be worse. We'll see. Someone's going to get hurt. I don't want them to. That's not what I'm saying. So we have two other things we want to talk about today, and one of them is a little bit touchy. And that's why we want to talk about it.

Alvin Owusu (28:45.73)
Yeah, at least we have those guys.

Alvin Owusu (28:58.466)
Yeah, let's go ahead and get into it. I was gonna say our colleague, but we're not media members, so John Wertheim is not our colleague. this happened, I mean, this was almost two weeks ago when this went down, but we're gonna talk about it. John Wertheim from the Tennis Channel and of 60 Minutes and of the Surf Podcast with Andy Roddick made a comment on a hot mic.

that did not shine a good light on the physical appearance of Barbora Krejcikova. I think by this point, if you are a listener of this podcast, you've probably already seen the video or at least heard the audio. was on the hot mic, getting ready to go on air, made a comment about her forehead more or less.

Matt (29:44.679)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. You've seen the headline.

Matt (29:56.101)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Alvin Owusu (29:58.376)
He was then suspended indefinitely from his tennis channel commentating responsibilities. Matthew, what say you about this particular situation?

Matt (30:14.087)
I think all of us can end up saying things that are stupid, especially those of us who maybe were born in the 20th century, right? Like it does happen.

But the truth is there's two things that are true. Number one, don't talk about people's bodies in a negative way. And maybe don't even talk about people's bodies in general, but I don't know about that. When we're talking about sports, it's tricky. But the other thing is there's just no room for error.

And that's an interesting thing to note. I think you need to, I mean, he was obviously making fun of her. Like that's the other thing. It's not like, wow, look at XYZ player's legs. What a powerhouse. I think she could karate kick me into the stands. You know, that's different. And I think it's just, you have to be careful when you're a straight white man talking about.

Alvin Owusu (30:55.509)
Right, yes.

Matt (31:12.763)
Other people's bodies and that's that's how I that's that's where I'm gonna leave it for now But I think that I think you have to be careful I think if you want to elevate women and you want to to have parody and have Same bag at the end of a tournament you have to You got to do a little better than that because I think Making fun of a man's forehead if he was like balding or something

Alvin Owusu (31:19.191)
Right.

Matt (31:42.643)
would the same thing happen?

Alvin Owusu (31:45.236)
You know, that's an interesting point that I hadn't considered. That I hadn't considered. And I think, while I haven't considered it, it probably also doesn't matter because where we are in civilization, like, you just can't make disparaging comments about, like, from a straight man's perspective to a female's perspective. It's just, there actually is no gray area. And the thing is, he,

Matt (32:06.853)
Yeah. Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (32:14.156)
copped to it, he fully owned it, he apologized.

Matt (32:16.645)
He's connected to her, he's like really good friends with her agent or something, but I think he's still indefinitely suspended. So it's just something that happened and it matters and it's okay to acknowledge it, I guess, is where we wanted to leave it.

Alvin Owusu (32:20.373)
Right, yeah.

Alvin Owusu (32:28.194)
So yeah, and I think my perspective is aligned with yours. What I'm curious about is what do you think should happen next? So he fully owned it. He apologized to her directly. He's been very outspoken about how sorry he is. He's had a long career in this game. He's been, he's highly respected, made a mistake.

owned up to it. He's in the doghouse right now. So what happens next? What should happen next? guess that's a better, more poignant question.

Matt (32:56.71)
Yeah.

Matt (33:02.99)
I think we want to have a world where you can have a conversation about that and someone works to make it okay and doesn't make the mistake again.

Alvin Owusu (33:14.604)
So if you found yourself watching the United Cup in a couple weeks, and let's just fast forward. Let's say it's after Australia and you find yourself watching the Dallas Open. That's a plug. I might be there. And John Wertheim is, John Wertheim's on the call. Are you taking it back? Are you go, all right, he made a mistake, he did his time. Let's move on. Yeah.

Matt (33:26.919)
Texas tennis.

Matt (33:39.611)
I think so. I think so. If he continues to show that he learned from something, I mean, we have kids, kids mess up, people mess up. Did you learn from it? Cool. I think those of us with cool heads and open hearts need to stick together in this timeframe. anyway, we have one more thing we're going to do. And one of the things about me is I am not a player.

Alvin Owusu (33:46.144)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (33:49.61)
Right. Right.

Alvin Owusu (33:59.904)
Yeah. All right. Well.

Let's do the thing.

Alvin Owusu (34:09.026)
You just crush a lot.

Matt (34:09.656)
I'm exactly, RIP, and I love, I love gear. When I get into something, I get into gear, right? Cameras did cameras been there, you know, get, get excited about a lot of things. I'm excited about tennis rackets. You guys have taught me a lot. feel like even though I don't play, I'm a Yonex man. I am a Yonex man and a, okay. My imaginary, my imaginary racket is a Yonex and I saw something,

Alvin Owusu (34:16.183)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (34:28.898)
I like that. I like that about you.

Matt (34:37.242)
And this is what we call material things. The WTA.

you know, Rolex is now the official time keeper and time piece of the WTA with the Swiss watchmaker continuing its support of the WTA finals. got a picture of Coco Golf here in the announcement on the WTAtennis.com. And I just want to say as a, as a passionate material thing, know, Dasef and I were, kind of going off about like Rolex. So amazing. It's so cool. You know, the perpetual commercials, all this stuff. And I just happened to be a watch nerd and I'm telling you that that's so cool, but go try.

I am buy a Rolex. You can't. You can't. You can't. You can't buy a new one. And I guess the whole point of what I'm saying, because we're going to run out of time, but it's like Rolex, women's tennis, cocoa, accessibility. I'm like, that's not Rolex. I said it. I said it. I like Rolex.

Alvin Owusu (35:14.995)
What's that like?

So I've heard, I've, so.

Alvin Owusu (35:36.258)
What's, yeah, so let's unpack this a little bit, just a tiny bit, because I was watching the chat blow up and I was like, got nothing to add here. I'm not a watch guy. I like to nerd out and I like a fine thing here or there, but watches, I haven't hit that point yet, but I am aware that you can't just go into a Rolex store and buy a watch. Like you have to.

Matt (35:50.905)
sure.

Alvin Owusu (36:04.322)
There's like this whole thing where, mean, go ahead and explain to me. So I'm aware of this, like, is the, have to like buy a wallet or you have to buy a house first? What do have to do?

Matt (36:08.837)
Yeah, I... Yeah, I mean...

Matt (36:15.619)
If you have to know who the authorized dealer is, you have to buy a bunch of stuff from them and they have to like you so that when the hotness comes in that Carlitos is wearing, that's how you get it. here's just to condense what was happening, like an old Rolex.

Alvin Owusu (36:30.646)
Mm-hmm.

Matt (36:38.191)
used is the same as a new Rolex because Rolex is so hot. Like it's not a product of the people anymore. And that's why I saw that sponsorship and I'm like, let me tell you guys something about trying to get a Rolex. Like you just can't get one and an old one is the same price as a new one. And that doesn't make any sense. I think that they sell aspirations, like you say, but I think our

Alvin Owusu (36:42.348)
Yeah.

Matt (37:03.963)
Rolex is an interesting sponsor for the WA tour because they are a sponsor but have no interest in sponsoring anybody. It's not an accessible product.

Alvin Owusu (37:13.079)
Hahaha

Matt (37:14.619)
When I see Grey Goose on the side of the US Open, can get me some Grey Goose. If you don't have a lot of money and your friend brought you to the US Open, you could probably save a couple shekels and get you a honeydews. You're having the experience. Rolex is not an experience that people can have. I just saw that. And that's material things. And one day, we're going to do material things and talk about strings and rackets. And it's going to be good. But I just had to say, as

Alvin Owusu (37:18.526)
Right. You can get a honeydiss.

Alvin Owusu (37:31.575)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (37:41.538)
all the things.

Matt (37:44.894)
as real lover of watches and think Rolex is really cool, was just like, come on, like G-Shock should be doing this. I said it.

Alvin Owusu (37:52.93)
I mean, Rolex, I mean, I know that the announcement was made and that is great, but Rolex is almost synonymous with tennis.

Matt (38:01.561)
I know and what that is is it's the old tennis. It's the country club. It's cats at the country club with their Rolexes and there, I said it to you and Doss F also there was a big massive hike in Rolex prices that coincided during COVID with crypto.

Alvin Owusu (38:05.224)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. It is.

Alvin Owusu (38:20.608)
Right. Okay.

Matt (38:21.541)
And when crypto tanked, so did the price of Rolex. So it's just like one of those things like, you love watches and lifestyle? Or are you just like, I need a Rolex? So it's just an interesting thing. And Rolex is a big part of tennis. And that's why it bears mentioning what's going on here. I'm not knocking the brand. I think it's really complicated. come on, guys. You need to give away. We need some Rolexes shooting out of the t-shirt guns.

Alvin Owusu (38:24.778)
Yep.

Alvin Owusu (38:31.613)
Right, okay.

Alvin Owusu (38:47.778)
Hahahaha

Matt (38:51.475)
sponsor some crowd people. anyway, yeah, I mean, I think that's all we have for today. It's been a pleasure. Great.

Alvin Owusu (38:59.094)
Yeah, this is good, it feels good, it's always good to be with you. So I'm glad we got a chance to connect today and talk to the people. yeah, absolutely. So thanks for joining us and we'll see you guys again soon. Take care.

Matt (39:01.743)
Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, we have to give the people what they want. So here we are.

Matt (39:14.917)
Alright, see everybody soon. Bye.