Sabalenka vs Rybakina and the Tactical Hierarchy Emerging After Indian Wells

Alvin Owusu (00:00.69)
And welcome to another episode of the best three podcast. I'm Alvin that's Tory and we're coming at you post Indian Wells I mean congratulations, Irina Sabalenka. Congratulations Yannick center We're gonna get after both of those matches and a lot more than that. But first and foremost th how you doing?

Torrey Hawkins (00:19.483)
Alvin, I'm good. Good day at tennis. Great day to watch. Looked like it was a hot situation out there. All the temps out there like 97, give or take, it wasn't that hot here in Atlanta, as you know, but great tennis out there. They don't call it the sunshine double for nothing, Alvin.

Alvin Owusu (00:35.608)
There's definitely plenty of sunshine available. And today we got some hot temperatures, which is definitely something we'll come to, I think played a major factor in both women's and men's finals. Like I said, Irina Sabalinka defeated Elena Rybakina in the women's final up first, and then Yannick Center defeated Daniil Mevedev in the men's final that came right after.

This is going to be a little more of a less of a, you know, tournament recap. You know, we don't really do a lot of that around here. I want to really get into some of the things that we, that this tournament showed us about not only where we currently are with the tour, but with these, uh, with these specific players. So I want to start with arena, Savalinka versus Elena or back in a, on this podcast, going all the way back to WTA finals, tour finals.

Torrey Hawkins (01:30.781)
Yep.

Alvin Owusu (01:32.715)
And then in our end of year recap, not to mention the grand slam that she won in the, think it finished technically in February, we call it January. I know that I said, and I believe you agreed that Elena Rabacca is one of the top two players in the world. Now on paper come Monday morning, that will be a true statement. She will be ranked number two tomorrow morning.

Torrey Hawkins (01:41.627)
Yep, yep.

Torrey Hawkins (01:51.037)
Period.

Torrey Hawkins (01:56.603)
Yep. Yep.

Alvin Owusu (02:00.364)
When we talk about the top two players in the world, and I look at, you know, obviously on paper and in my own opinion, Arena Sablevica and Alen Rebacca are the best two players in the world. Impenetrable force, immovable object. It's a, before I start getting into why I love this, now I think we can officially call it a rivalry now, why I love this rivalry and match up so much, I wanna get your perspective on not only what you're taking from

Torrey Hawkins (02:13.895)
We'll be watching.

Alvin Owusu (02:29.614)
where these two women are right now. Let's call it, you know, they've played six times in the last 14 months or so where they are now. But I also want to get into the standpoint of like true rivalries in which the players game styles are very, very similar.

Torrey Hawkins (02:36.829)
Yep.

Alvin Owusu (02:49.556)
in history. But I'll let you take the first one first.

Torrey Hawkins (02:51.421)
I think history is a great point and I think that's the first place to start. When you first talk about rivalry in the women's league, I have to go back to Martina and Chris. Dare I say the best rivalry in tennis on the women's side for decades. I would even submit that that rivalry helped to start the actual tour itself. There have been great players for many, many, many, many, many years.

Alvin Owusu (02:58.669)
Mm-hmm.

Torrey Hawkins (03:20.795)
that Martina Chris rivalry transcended generations. And there were three or four different acts slash epics, depending on how you wanna talk about it in the span of time.

I remember the early days when Martina still had dark hair, you know what I mean? And longer dark hair at that. I remember those, the days with the wooden rackets when Chris was still, you know, running around. But when she was still just Chris Everett and had become Chris Everett Lloyd. mean, so going back all that. And then the next era when Martina had the glasses and the, and a little more of a fit physique and had the shorter blonde hair and was making a, she really tuned into the fitness side of things. And then the later years when they had even more

more rivalry there toward the end of their career. Their rivalry...

And even now, know, their rivalry has turned to friendships. Both of them are dealing with some personal issues and illnesses and things that are... And they have found that each of them, as many years they competed against one another, they've also even turned to one another as friends as they're both battling some pretty heavy stuff with some cancers and whatnot. I say it to say, Alvin, that rivalry kept tennis alive. It kept tennis going.

amidst all the other players that were very good in their own right, you always knew that you measured them against those two. I look at the Borg-Macenro rivalry as a comparison. And I felt that Borg actually did Mac a disservice by, in a sense, quitting so abruptly. So I think how much better could Mac have gotten had it continued to be pushed by Borg. Now.

Torrey Hawkins (05:04.465)
We'll never know. But then I go back to Pete and Andre, right? I go back to all of the, mean, Serena had about four or five rivals, you know what I mean? Between, you know, for her 20 years. And so I wanna come back to this, but I wanna set the table with those icons of, and what the rivalry does for the game.

from marketing standpoint, a who's going to win this iteration standpoint, to leave you on the edge of your seat to see what that next player does as a result of the rivalry. I don't have to talk about

Fed and Nadal. We watched it for the last 20 years as it failed in that it kept going and I have to tell you Alvin they also carry tennis along with them. So that's I want to mention that part first because I feel like you have to really appreciate what a rivalry is and you're talking the top of the game.

to really get the sense of what we're talking about. And then you can kind of talk to rivalry now that these two very, very unbelievable, phenomenal players have now given us a new version of it with 2026, I'm gonna say terms, so to speak. What were you gonna say?

Alvin Owusu (06:15.949)
think it's important to kind of like look at like how the evolution of tennis has really impacted what an actual rivalry is, right? Those other players that you, yeah, those other players had so much more time because they all hit their peaks, not peaks, they all hit the top of the game so much earlier in their careers and were able to sustain, right? You're talking about two players, Elena Rabakhan has had some.

Torrey Hawkins (06:24.477)
And what was it?

Alvin Owusu (06:43.713)
some health issues, some off court issues, right? She wins Wimbledon, she finals Australian Open the very next year, and then she's kinda, not necessarily been in the lurch, but she's kinda been in the lurch as far as a contender for slams regularly at the same time while Arena was spending that time closing the gap between her and Iga, and then usurping Iga, and then fending off kind of different players.

who all have very different game styles. like, so when we're talking about a rivalry, I think this one doesn't hold a candle to the rest of those. And I don't think that it necessarily has to, and necessarily for the sake of this conversation, but it's gonna have to do a lot more work to get to that rarefied, that truly rarefied air of a generational rivalry. And it's quite...

Torrey Hawkins (07:13.724)
Yep.

Torrey Hawkins (07:40.989)
Thank

Alvin Owusu (07:42.349)
and quite likely that it does not.

Torrey Hawkins (07:45.027)
I would push back and say that it does. And that's why I think, that's why I wanted to go back history wise to set this. There were great players back when Borg and Macra played. They became the rivalry. Why? Because on any given day, they had the sauce that could do the damage to that player and that player knew it. What I look for in a rivalry album,

is a player that the other opponent knows has their number. And if they're playing great, not a player that can beat you, anybody can beat you. The player that you know has your number. The player that you know you have the hardest time with. The player that you look at in the draw and you're like, God.

Alvin Owusu (08:20.617)
Anyone can beat you.

Alvin Owusu (08:32.599)
Would it be easy to wrap that up and say, even on my best day, I'm not absolutely sure that I'm going to win?

Torrey Hawkins (08:41.083)
match and that to me and if you just happen to be at the place in the game where you are one or two and that player is two or one and you know you're gonna meet each other on match six or seven on the tour on that and all the big ones coming up where you almost cheer for the opponent for knocking out your opponent. You're like yes.

remind me to give her by her purse, you know, because she helped me out.

I did not want to play her again this week. I wasn't feeling my best this week. Those are rivalries. And I feel like there are rivals, you know, that you have in sports all the time. We're going to call it conference rivals and rivals that you've had for decades because of where you are, Michigan, Ohio State, you know, those type of rivalries that will always span the test of time. And then in tennis, it's very personal. It's very specific. And there can only be one number one and one number two.

And so when those one and two come together, you know.

This was also, if I'm not mistaken, what the conference was talking about, this was the third time that Irina has been in the finals and she has not won Indian Wells, ironically. And so ironically, with all the slams up to this point, know, Rebecca has won Indian Wells, right, and hadn't had the same good fortune in a lot of the slams up to this point, until this past year. So I feel like what we're looking into this whole thing, we're looking into this whole, now you're starting to really see, so, and then the two of these

Alvin Owusu (09:55.937)
That was the first time winning, yep.

Torrey Hawkins (10:17.147)
right so that's why I think this is gonna be a bit of a rivalry I think we're back in it is coming back it's back with it in full force and I think that Sabalinka while she's been defining her career and she's been in a sense edging out Sviatnatec and edging out and kind of being more consistent than the golfs and the you know I guess we're gonna put in there

you know, three or four other top players, know, including Anissa Mova, Coco Golf, including, you know, I'm going to put one more in there. I'll put Pagula and maybe one or two others that are trying to get to that same rarefied air. These two have now...

and Rebecca and I has in a sense played a little bit of catch up, they are now positioning themselves as the new one and two. All roads go through us now on the tour. And I think that's where I'm getting at. That's why this is the rivalry right now. How long it stays there, well, it always depends on everybody else, but it will come through them. It'll be on their terms how long they stay. And it looks like right now they'll be there for a while.

Alvin Owusu (11:29.293)
You know what's wild? Eega and Arena finished the year one and two. They played one time last year. Like one time. And I think that was the, yeah, that was the Roland Garros semi, right? like, which is, that was a, I mean, we talked about that match. Some people knocked the match a little bit, but I loved that match. I loved that. That was one of top five matches I watched on the women's side last year. But as far as rivalry goes, like,

Torrey Hawkins (11:39.185)
Was that a Semi?

Torrey Hawkins (11:46.045)
Actually not.

Torrey Hawkins (11:54.525)
That's it. That's it for me.

Thank

Alvin Owusu (11:58.584)
They were one and two and met twice. That just tells me, they're not meeting in finals. That's where one and two would normally meet. Arena made her fair share of finals last year. She finaled three of the four Grand Slams.

Torrey Hawkins (12:08.86)
Yep.

Torrey Hawkins (12:13.245)
and Eega and Eega made one and beat Amanda Ohno. But unfortunately the way the numbers went, as we talked about often, numerically, numerically it didn't work out that way for them both. And Coco had other plans, both for Eega and for, you know, for Arena and the French, well sorry, in the French with Arena. But I also feel like it's something that...

Alvin Owusu (12:18.049)
Right.

Torrey Hawkins (12:38.853)
We haven't seen that same level of staying power at the top from a Cocoa, from an Eega, from an Amanda, from others. And again, does that mean they're not great players? You kidding me? These ladies are the absolute best of the best. But now you're talking about...

can we continue to stay at the top of the heap? And that's a whole nother level of greatness to be able to do it time in and time out. know, some would even say by comparison that.

Torrey Hawkins (13:13.455)
center stubbed his toe a little bit against one of the all-time greats in Australia. That's how fine a line it is when 24 Grand Slam champ, you know, edges you out in a long match and you stub your toe to not to get to that latest edition of your rivalry. So that's how tough this whole thing is. And that's what I'm saying. It's so hard to get there, but we've now seen the finals of the women's tour final and we've now seen the finals of the

Alvin Owusu (13:17.845)
Right.

Alvin Owusu (13:43.565)
Australian up and.

Torrey Hawkins (13:44.181)
Australian Open and now we're seeing the fans of Indian Wells. It's starting to shape up like a rivalry album because they are continuing to move. All rivalry questions go through us and I think that's what we're starting to see.

Alvin Owusu (13:54.347)
Right. And they met four times last year, but I think I'm going to kind of even double back on my comment about Iga and Arena only meeting once last year. If you're one and two, that means the only time you are going to play each other is in the finals. And it's really hard to do that when one through eight in the world is capable of reaching a Grand Slam final. I think that speaks, it probably speaks more to the parody within the women's, the top of the women's game right now.

Torrey Hawkins (14:22.669)
Some who've done so you know I mean you've got you get 40 for grand slam champs You know over the last two years in that or has or has been including Madison in that top eight so That that's what but in my opinion. That's what raises the specter of this rivalry because Amidst those same players they are starting to outpace the others and I think that's why I'm mentioning I think this one's a little different and has staying power because it's been fairly consistent

Alvin Owusu (14:24.895)
Exactly.

Torrey Hawkins (14:51.773)
and those players haven't gotten worse, these two have raised their game. that's not to say that it won't be upset, it's not to say that one of couldn't go out early in the round in the French. But what I will say is it's starting to shape up like a pretty good rivalry. for what I see right now, when these two are starting to really take tennis to another level on the women's side of things, and the parity remains, which is what makes us all the more remarkable.

Alvin Owusu (15:18.922)
Yeah, let's get into that matchup a little bit, right? And I think one of the more interesting things about this particular rivalry, like rivalries are often built on, there's a little bit of difference between the players, right? I think a really good, a really easy example of this one is Fed in a doll, right? One is a very smooth, righty, picture perfect, the other one's a...

muscular lefty, they play very different styles, they are very different off court, on court. So many things different about them, but those differences made for very, very interesting tennis matchups, right? Battles, of tension there. a lot of contrast, yes. You would like some contrast in your rivalries. I think we're starting to see that with Yannick and Carlos. Look, we made it 15 minutes in the podcast, didn't minister to Carlos Alcaraz until now, perfect.

Torrey Hawkins (16:00.349)
a lot of contrast to your point.

Torrey Hawkins (16:11.717)
No.

Alvin Owusu (16:13.356)
That's for some of you out there. but those two, right, they're both extremely dominant. They obviously hit the ball very hard, but they do it in very different ways, very different demeanors. Contrast, again, I think on the tennis court, on the surface, these women do the same thing. Elena's first serve is the best in the women's game. I'd say number two is probably Irina Sabalika, right?

Torrey Hawkins (16:24.125)
Yep.

Torrey Hawkins (16:35.357)
Thank

Torrey Hawkins (16:41.469)
A close second, I might add.

Alvin Owusu (16:43.326)
A close second, both fantastic, I mean, power in spades, right? Their demeanors are very different on the court. You've got, know, one wears her, exactly, one wears her heart on her sleeve, the other one has got ice in the veins, right? Winner, I couldn't tell if Elena's, me, Rebecca had won or lost that match afterwards. It didn't look very different than any other handshake that she's had. She's like, good match, that's that's it.

Torrey Hawkins (16:48.518)
Yep.

Thank

Fire in the house.

Torrey Hawkins (16:59.298)
Yes.

Torrey Hawkins (17:08.751)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (17:12.364)
That's it. But when you start to dig into it a little bit, right, what are some of the nuanced differences that you see with your coach's eye? And I want to start with Ms. Rebacca first. What does she do that puts pressure on Irina Sabalenka to a point where it doesn't allow her to do what she wants to do?

Torrey Hawkins (17:35.869)
Marina likes to take away your time first and your court second.

Alvin Owusu (17:44.747)
What does that mean?

Torrey Hawkins (17:46.941)
and Alana likes to do the opposite. And I know it sounds simple, I'll break it down. When I am a power player, pace takes away your time. You have the ability to take it early, but if I hit another big ball, I now run you, which she does all the time, and now you have to really play a pretty good on the rise ball and cover it well to not lose time.

Alvin Owusu (17:53.443)
Break it down.

Torrey Hawkins (18:16.439)
I think of it in terms of increments of seconds. You and I are playing, I'm Arena, you're backing up. I run you out wide. Big serve. Whether I go behind you in front of you, doesn't matter, I'm moving you all the same. I'm taking it early, I may only take a quarter of a second from you. Your ball comes back just as big, but I'm meeting the ball early. My next ball, because all you can do is take, is

hit the same ball back to me and counter. If I do the same thing again, I take away another quarter of a second. Now I'm half a second ahead. If I can deliver the goods one more time, this is where the compound interest of pace and tactics hit. Quarter of a second, quarter of a second, full second. Because once I take you on the next one, you have to loop, slice, can open something to buy the time back. You just simply can't continue to counter.

Right? The pace or the time I'm taking away.

Alvin Owusu (19:19.894)
Let's clarify time because I had this conversation with other people before or after we've had this conversation. As I interpret it, when you say losing time, I interpret that as, as a player, I want to be back to the point of recovery that I want to be at and on balance by the time you hit the next shot. So if you pull me out wide on the outside, so I'm left-handed.

Torrey Hawkins (19:45.085)
Excellent.

Alvin Owusu (19:48.3)
I hit that ball, if I hit it too hard, I can't get to a recovery point and be split step on balance by the time you hit that back hit. And if I'm not, I've left a lot of court open, so I can either, I can choose to either not fully recover, I can choose to fully recover and not be on balance to take away that down the line, and then either way, now I'm off balance, now my cross court's a little more open. So being on time.

Torrey Hawkins (20:05.34)
Yup.

Yeah.

Torrey Hawkins (20:13.667)
or hit up to buy time but give you the next aggressive shot.

Alvin Owusu (20:16.563)
Right, exactly. So that's what we mean by managing time. Always, if you have time, you are in control of your body when your opponent hits the next shot.

Torrey Hawkins (20:29.085)
100 % and I'll even go make it even simpler. Let's use time itself as our increment and as our if you want to call it our unit of measure One second, let's just call it a second. Okay, a full one full one Mississippi. Okay ball hit ball returns one second each We're both tagging them all pretty good. That's a pretty good pace. That's a

Very high level pace, you're talking upwards, upper 80s, low 90s, maybe potentially a little faster depending on who you are. But ball hit, ball return, ball hit again. Boom, stop the shot clock, that's two seconds total. If I move up and hit that ball just a tad bit sooner, just a tad bit earlier, I'm gonna use a quarter of a second as a level of measure. I have now upped the ante. I have taken away a quarter of a second.

for you to return said ball, for you to recover from said ball, for you to decide where you're gonna hit said ball. And I feel like I can cover most of the court if I do so, depending on what you hit back. I know you may counter aggressively, hit one on the corner, hit one on line, loop, slice, doesn't matter. I am taking the risk and I'm gonna do this because I feel like I'm pretty good at it. And sound like it's pretty good at it. The second ball is where the rubber meets the road, because now I gotta do it a couple of times.

Alvin Owusu (21:23.627)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Torrey Hawkins (21:51.267)
Rebacca makes you do it four times, by the way. But let's say that happens. She can delay, I'm gonna say in some ways, the inevitable if Irina hits the ball just right. Because now she can take that second cut, third cut, fourth cut, all she's doing is continuing to take away increments of the second without giving you much time back. Now, here's where Rebacca has the ability to flip the script. She can hit the ball back so big, so deep,

that the on the rise ball that you're looking to hit is at your feet. And now you have to bump, scoop, or deflect, not counter, not strike, not attack, but defend in a sense because she can hit the ball so big back to you down the middle that your on the rise ball actually floats back. And so the quarter of a second you took might take you a second and a quarter.

back to me which buys her the time back. What Sabalinkin does very well when she's on the run she will she will counterpunish she will hit you in the spot that you don't necessarily want to be in she has a very good slice on both sides and you saw the slide the tournament players are blocking that return just deep enough knowing that most aren't comfortable coming forward and taking out of the air to be able to rip the next ball off the first strike and that's a that's a very very tactical smart technically smart

thing to do because how many girls are going to come forward in certain volley? None. Right? So it's actually a pretty smart tactic. But you also leave the door open for the person to counterpunish. So that quarter of a second they take, you rip that ball back deep. If they bump, roll, or slice and scoop that ball back, it's probably sitting up in the middle of the court. You're going back from bumper turn in the corner, big huge back hit on the run, to a step up forehand on ball three. Now that's been some steps.

in that rally, but you are now back to zero. And that's the key I want to talk about, Alvin, zero. Remember, one second there, one second back. The time difference is zero. I take a quarter of a second away, boom! The time difference is on your side. I have to return it back as big, as clean, as deep, or I am a quarter of a second back. If I'm a quarter of a second back,

Alvin Owusu (23:58.528)
neutral.

Torrey Hawkins (24:12.221)
And that next bullet comes in the corner. Boom, I'm a half a second back. And that's when you start seeing time taken away. As the time keeps getting taken away, Arena is very good at coming forward. She's very good at managing, going behind you, going in front of you. It's a big point. She loves using it. And she will eventually come forward on you through a barrage of taking your time away. And then she takes away your court. Very classic, very, very good tennis. She's just the better 2026 version of Serena.

Davenport, Jennifer Capriati, all the big hitters who have come before. Celis, she is that player in 2026 form. On the flip side, what is Rebekah gonna do? Her cross-court is so cross, she takes court from you first. And now she puts you in a spot where you gotta decide if I don't pick right. I'm out of time, I can get this ball, but I got no good options.

Alvin Owusu (25:10.923)
So there's.

Torrey Hawkins (25:11.183)
And she takes away your court first and as a result makes you go for poor choices while she's stepping on the next ball and she's the absolute same similar because they both have the ball big. But Rebecca will take you cross three times more than you thought she would go across because you've got to hold them. You've got to defend the line. And she'll go cross one more time. And Yankee gets a little bit wider. And the wider you go, Alvin, the wider you go, the more court you've got to cover.

And there's her back and adjust when you think, ah, she's got to go line. I'm going to cheat line because I got to cheat. At this point, I'm out of court. She goes cross one more time. you're like, there's some shots where you're busy leaning line. She's going back cross on a step in forehand. And you're like, I don't know to cover that. Well, you're not covering it because you know she has both options. And that's I feel this is a small, just a very small difference in the game.

But Rebecca and this ball is so good, the cross court will beat the down line all day long. That's just tennis geometry. And Rebecca and it does that better than anybody. And she does it on the serve and the return.

Alvin Owusu (26:18.443)
So one thing I guess for those listening or watching, think of the mental picture, maybe one day we'll put these in the podcast, I don't know. Think of the mental picture of Irina Sabalenka hitting ground strokes from the double zali. You don't see that often. You see it a lot when she's playing against Rebecca. And that is the width that Elena can create. And it's not a heavy, it's not like she's using

Torrey Hawkins (26:26.93)
Yes.

Torrey Hawkins (26:38.685)
has to.

Alvin Owusu (26:48.061)
a lot of spin to create that angle. She is just using leverage and an extremely firm left hand. Like she sends that thing on a rope crossing the singles line, single side line. And that is a very unique spot that arena sabalinka doesn't normally have to play from. And I think that's why you often see, almost going back to your time comment, right? When you are slowly taking time, know, 10th of a second here, 10th of a second here, cumulative, now they're quarter second behind.

when they do hit that winner, you're like, that shot looks so safe. It's like, cause they actually earned that winner three shots ago. And by the time they pull it line, yes, by the time they pull it line, you were nowhere, you're not even close to it. They don't have, the risk level is extremely low for them. And they've got all day to send it three feet from the sideline and four feet from the baseline, and you can't touch it.

Torrey Hawkins (27:25.511)
three shots a go.

Thank you.

Torrey Hawkins (27:39.965)
She actually went line more today Rebecca than I've seen her in times past. She went big cross more often early like she always does with some bigger shots on my head down balls you thought she'd have gone line on. There was about five or six just almost

Winners that you're like, how does she not go for that ball? Well, because she's leaning, you you're leaning one way or the other. You know what mean? It's like, it's like, know, Steph Curry coming down on a three on two, you know what I mean? Who do you cover? You know what I mean? He can stop and pop and drill you for three and go past you and throw the alley-oop. You don't know what to cover because he's that good. Same thing here. And I feel, and I feel like that's one of the things that when you're watching, we're back in the play.

One of the beauties of her game is that she creates that extra time. Her ball rarely is purposeless and cross court. She's getting you sideline cross. Now you gotta make a decision. Do I go bigger? Do I roll? Do I go line? She automatically puts you in a tough spot. Because if you go line, she has a chance to go back cross bigger and that's what runs you. If you go back cross, you're safe, but she can go line or she can go back wider cross.

and now you're in a tough situation. So what do you do? You have to do different things. And when I thought Irina did great today, she kept changing it up. She drilled her enough line to make her, to keep her honest. She drilled her back deep middle enough times to make sure she didn't have the right ball.

And then she took her back big cross counter to that same ball and then took the punishment, which is three balls on the run to get back to the ball that she wanted. And I really feel that that little bit of gut check, you know, is really what one of the match she was willing to go to those long ones, that long exchange where she's going to go back cross knowing that she has to cover both options, but she's going to do it three more shots to prove to Alana.

Torrey Hawkins (29:36.221)
I will go the distance with you. You're not going to bully me into going for that dumb down the line that I know you're looking for to run me three more shots. I'm going to go back cross with you because I know that's what you want me to do. I'm going to go cross and you're going to run me and I'm okay with that because I'm in good enough shape and I'm fast enough and I'm as tall as you are that I'm going to do the distance that you know most players won't.

Alvin Owusu (30:01.236)
So that's the thing that is like, okay, I'm really, really glad you said that because when you looked at the last three matches that Rebecca played in this tournament, right? JPEG in the quarters, she played Svitolina in the semis, and then she played Rebecca in the final. The first two sets against Pugula and Svitolina were very similar. The second two sets were very similar. Even today you saw some similarities.

Starting to creep in in the sabalink a match right when we're back in it comes out on fire It's a lot to deal with it is a lot to deal with right and so you have these I think you call you turn the term water bugs, right? I mean JPEG's not really a water bug, but we're back in the turns are into one You just see a lot of running you're just running right her and Spinelli. No, I mean JPEG and Spinelli. No both We're just running holding on for dear life until eventually some fatigue starts to set in

Torrey Hawkins (30:35.857)
Man.

Torrey Hawkins (30:47.581)
on.

Torrey Hawkins (30:53.373)
That's the way.

Alvin Owusu (30:58.504)
Right, middle of the second set, starts missing, serve percentage drops a little bit, right, and now you have a chance to start getting in the match, right, and the same thing happened in the quarters that happened in the semis, right, you had a chance to get in the match. But then Rebecca was able to shut the door, right, because at the end of the match, it's hard to close out sets when you don't have the firepower, right, because Rebecca has that thing that most of the other women do not have, is

Torrey Hawkins (30:58.589)
Yep.

Torrey Hawkins (31:05.126)
Yep.

Yep.

No.

Alvin Owusu (31:27.818)
Like when I need one I can hit one that you can't hit back The closer yes, the the old John rocker if you will right? From those are those that's old enough from Atlanta. If you know, know the old John rocker. So That's that is what separates these two women from I think the rest of the field, right? And you saw that separation in the quarters in the semis even when we're back and got a little shaky she was able to close the door

Torrey Hawkins (31:30.845)
That's right.

The Closer.

Torrey Hawkins (31:38.725)
Right.

Torrey Hawkins (31:55.196)
Yep.

Alvin Owusu (31:57.737)
Right in this match today Arena has gotten fit enough and fast enough to do that Wait for the dip and then bring her own rocker, right now. She's like, okay if I break you I can also then serve out and then continue to put pressure on you step up on second serve returns Like you hit you hit a 92 mile hour kicker out wide on the second serve I'm big enough that if I if I step in my hands are fast enough my strike zones big enough

Torrey Hawkins (31:57.981)
Yeah, we.

Torrey Hawkins (32:05.659)
That's

Torrey Hawkins (32:18.438)
See you.

Torrey Hawkins (32:23.069)
Yes.

Torrey Hawkins (32:27.653)
Right. That's right. Because Rebacca is tired too. It's just, who's more tired and who's going for more of a steadier is more of a safer option. But Rebacca is still tired. And she has that same level of looks very placid, looks very stoic, but under all that...

Alvin Owusu (32:27.806)
that I can I can still take it. I can still take it where those other women cannot.

Alvin Owusu (32:35.25)
Right, exactly, it happens to everyone.

Torrey Hawkins (32:52.925)
you know all that you know disguise she's still dying out there like you are it's still 97 degrees it's still it's still hot as Hades and you are still dealing with the stress of all because she's good but she's still human as we all are and she will take that dip physically and I think that's one of the things that really that Sabalinka I was impressed that Sabalinka put her own fitness

into that situation to allow herself to go the distance to just get her a little bit tired, a few more second serves, a little less pop on the ball. But again, that's a lot to wager. That's a lot to wager for you. If you haven't put in the work, that's not a strategy you can employ over time. That's a strategy you can only do if you really have been putting in the work and feel that confident with your fitness to be able to put that up there as one of your weapons.

is to say as collateral, I will match you this and I will raise you this because I'm in good shape to do this and I can still have the goods on my first serve because I have legs left because I'm in that good of shape and that's what I'm looking for nothing today.

Alvin Owusu (33:56.139)
I'm gonna come back, I wanna come back to that one. They also say like we don't rise to the occasion, we fall to our level of preparation, And when you build that base of fitness, like match six and it's 95 degrees in the air, yeah, in the air, that's clock temp, right? Not on court temp. It's bacon, we're in the back end of the third set, right? You got the whole, got week and a half of matches on your legs.

Torrey Hawkins (34:03.791)
all the level of effort or systems, exactly.

Torrey Hawkins (34:18.268)
Bye.

Torrey Hawkins (34:21.789)
Yes.

Alvin Owusu (34:24.5)
You got two hours on your legs here. I mean, I think a lot of people are gonna point to five all third set, right? That 12 minute long service game, or I don't know how you look at it. There were so many opportunities, I think probably for both players, mean, part of me, Arena had a look at us some second serves on the outside there on break points. There were also some really, really good second serves by Elena Rabackina.

Torrey Hawkins (34:30.064)
I see.

First thing.

Torrey Hawkins (34:40.551)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (34:53.886)
being down repeated break point second serve to the number one play in the world and still having the the gall to crank up. Okay, maybe 91 not gonna get it done. Let's go 95. Let's go 95 character the body like That's gross. That's that's gross. No, you're not gonna pull one on me line because I'm going I'm going right at you pull that But then after that game I thought even leading up to that point right when when arena got the break in the in the third

Torrey Hawkins (35:01.789)
Yep. Yep. Yep.

Torrey Hawkins (35:11.653)
Yeah. Yes.

Torrey Hawkins (35:20.338)
Yep.

Alvin Owusu (35:20.422)
To be and she was up break. I was like I was texting, you know Matt and I said and I'm like one of the chances that that arena just gets to a point where she serves this thing out at five like at Up a break serves this thing out like it's men's 90s tennis and all of us were like no chance It's not we're not gonna get to that point and naturally there was the break and then that that big hole that five all That was the five all game. Yeah, but then again you see

Torrey Hawkins (35:30.621)
Yep, no tape.

Torrey Hawkins (35:38.289)
Yeah. Was that that was that that was that that game?

Alvin Owusu (35:47.594)
Elena is tired during that game. You know, arena's tired too. What did arena step up and do the very next game? She held serve. She held serve like she held serve. Like she just held serve. And yeah, and the, and the difference didn't come until the very last, like the very end of that tie breaker when we're back in this up a break, many break in the, and the breaker trying to serve did not make a first serve or any of the point arena gets the, the mini break back.

Torrey Hawkins (36:09.821)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (36:17.193)
Six five, what did she do? Makes first serve. That's legs baby. That's all legs. And when we talk about it comes down to literally legs and the ability to step up to the line and make a first serve at two hours and 20 minutes at the back end of a slugfest. That's how slim of margins we're talking about. I mean hats off to, go ahead, no no you go ahead.

Torrey Hawkins (36:40.349)
And I think we'll see a lot more of that because I feel like this was a gut check loss for Atlanta and this was a gut check win for arena. 100%.

Alvin Owusu (36:47.954)
I hope so.

Alvin Owusu (36:56.679)
You think so? think? I feel like I took nothing from that match except for man, women's tennis is awesome right now and it's so cool that we get to see these two heavyweights go after it.

Torrey Hawkins (37:05.103)
And it's that too. And it's that too. But remember, she hasn't beaten her recently. And she's the one to snipe for doing it. And she wanted this match. Now she has the belief that she can beat her. Now you're going to see some more tactical things coming in because now you have that confidence to say, okay, I've beaten you before. And if I have to do that again, I will, but I can also do it differently.

Alvin Owusu (37:11.207)
Yeah, yep, yep, set up for.

Torrey Hawkins (37:33.243)
Now that I believe, now that I've done it recently, I know I can do it again. And now you're gonna start seeing the tactical matchups. And Alvin, that's what makes a rivalry. I've beaten you one way, guess what's gonna happen? Elena's gonna get back in better shape, so it doesn't happen again. And now she's gonna have to find another way to beat her. Elena's gonna come back and beat her another way. Elena's gonna start coming forward on those block returns. And now you've got to find another way. And that's what makes a great rivalry. It doesn't ever stop.

The iterations are all a bit different. And that's what you look forward to in these matches. What will you do next? What will I force you to do? Because I showed you that what you gave me last wasn't good enough. And now what will happen? Alvin, what's gonna happen now? Alana's gonna get in better shape, stronger legs. How many times we see her leaning over a racket, holding her knees. You know what I She was gassed. And Arena was not. And I feel like we're not saying she wasn't tired of winning. Of course she was.

Alvin Owusu (38:31.731)
Mm-hmm.

Torrey Hawkins (38:31.965)
Heck, no. But I say it to say, now what happens when Atlanta gets stronger, gets a little more physically fit, now she's going to come back another way. And now, Arena's got to have another way to find a way to beat her. That's what makes a great rivalry, is when the two push each other.

to keep getting better. And that's what I look forward to in this out of these two and the women's game as a whole. But I feel like for those two in particular, that's why I'm calling it the rivalry right now because the two of them have shown when they're playing their best tennis, you can't beat us. You know what mean? We're playing our best tennis. And now each of us have been able to, know, King Kong, Godzilla, been able to hurt the other one, you know, to almost to a draw in many cases. So where the others are very good, Ega, Coco.

All of them are, I mean, you could keep going on the list. We haven't forgotten about Mira. We haven't forgotten about, you know, who's my other top five player there that's, I won't say PEC for sure, but I'm thinking of one more that I feel like I'm always forgetting giving her props. God, I just had her name a second ago. And by the way, Sutilina has been on fire since Australia, by the way. I can't forget her name.

Alvin Owusu (39:31.011)
JPEG.

Alvin Owusu (39:46.227)
She's max, she's maxing. talk about like.

Torrey Hawkins (39:48.541)
Absolutely plans for the best ball of her career right now. You know what I mean? So

Alvin Owusu (39:51.634)
All you want is somebody to play to the top. All I want is for someone to play to the top of their potential. is straight maxing right now, like in the best way.

Torrey Hawkins (39:59.101)
1000%. Just, and I'm so proud of her and having some of best tennis right now. I just say it to say, these other players are still playing some darn good tennis. I mean, darn good tennis. And I feel like we're at a point now where, but these two are starting to separate. They're starting to separate themselves just a little bit, Alvin. Just enough to say, yeah, we got this.

Alvin Owusu (40:20.521)
It's the separation that I push back on because here's what I am not necessarily afraid of, but this is something that is, this is just math. If they're ranked one and two and you add in the parity in the women's game, that just reduces the opportunities for them to actually play each other. They can only meet in the finals, right? So the chances of them both getting there in the tournaments that they're all going to be participating in, it's just like, I mean, we're back in a.

Torrey Hawkins (40:35.762)
Yep.

Torrey Hawkins (40:40.285)
Thank you.

Alvin Owusu (40:48.551)
She's a fit it's a coin toss if she if she loses to like in Boko, right because in Boko plays her well And that's just that that is a bit of a matchup problem and Boko is the like the hybrid of like has like arena kind of firepower but like water bug like Court coverage. It's it's a horrible. It's such a really really bad matchup for Elena because she will make enough balls Long enough to get to that that that dip

Torrey Hawkins (41:06.235)
phenomenal speed.

Alvin Owusu (41:16.797)
that Atlanta usually has around the mid second set and then has the firepower to actually then push through. So I think that's.

Torrey Hawkins (41:16.967)
That's right.

Torrey Hawkins (41:23.229)
I agree, she gave Amanda all she could handle, you know what mean? And that upset win against her, I don't disagree, but those are bad matchups.

I'm not sure if they are, is that to say that the road won't be pleasant? It'll be a little bumpy 1000%. I'm not saying that the road won't be. What I'm saying is I feel like they are starting to separate and I have an hope I'm wrong. But I would look forward to the next iteration as they are now one and two. You're gonna have to bring your best game and that's all I'm getting at. And I'm not saying that the rest have been relegated. What I'm saying is I feel these two are starting to just hit a gear that most haven't and I feel

like it's something that's really starting to really be really fun to watch and I feel like the the true champions will continue to make adjustments and try to try to compete at that level and I say that for the men's game and the women's game it's only gonna keep getting a little bit tougher and buddy you better you better hit the gym you better hit the gym and you better be willing to take that risk with that shot because you know you're gonna have to take it from somebody they're not gonna give it to you

Alvin Owusu (42:32.488)
Absolutely, I think that's a really good place to transition over to the men's side. Where we're usually, know, I, often times we are looking forward to a potential Yannick Center versus Carlo Alcaraz matchup. I am, I'm as, yeah, exactly, I'm as guilty as anyone, right? I was watching, I watch a lot of these matches through the lens of like, ooh, can we preserve that? Can we get another chapter in the,

Torrey Hawkins (42:36.273)
Yeah. Sure.

Torrey Hawkins (42:49.396)
You're gonna have mad at me in

Alvin Owusu (43:01.18)
Like just like I mentioned about the women's side, it takes a lot of hard work and a little bit of good fortune as well for one and two to end up in the finals, right? We did not get that on the men's side. And I think it's probably a good thing because what we did get is the resurgence of one Danil Mabedev. So, but before we get into that, let's give Yannick Sinah his due credit, right? He's back to his winning ways.

Torrey Hawkins (43:20.775)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (43:29.512)
Couple tournaments that he played and did not win. Okay now he's back into the finals didn't participate in any walls last year He's in this year. He wins it 7 6 7 6 against Daniel medvedev in the final it's a lot of this is same old Yannick in that He continues to put a ton of pressure on you as an opponent He really like obviously there's the pace. There's the depth

Right, there's the service become a it's a legitimate legitimate weapon But I think what I've seen from him is the culmination of being at the top of the game for the last two years is Same thing I saw in the in the match against Fonseca showed up in the two tiebreakers today When the chips are down, he's ready to roll. He's not gonna he's not gonna blink. He's not gonna blink He's gonna be pleased to put himself in a position got down for in the second set tiebreaker and didn't know got no more points, right?

Torrey Hawkins (44:03.143)
Yeah.

Torrey Hawkins (44:19.261)
That's right. That's right.

Torrey Hawkins (44:25.787)
Yep.

Alvin Owusu (44:28.622)
And went and he won that tiebreaker going away the same way he won the second set tiebreaker going away against fun sec or ripping returns

Torrey Hawkins (44:35.805)
Yeah, more aggressive than I've seen him in those moments to date and I have to even go back to the semi against Vera. He showed that he was willing to take more risks, take more time away, come forward and shorten points. He wasn't gonna just run down four or five balls before he started his offense. I agree with you. I even told you that when we talked about this mid Indian Wells, I was impressed with how he beat Yao.

It wasn't that he beat Fonseca. He beat him being more aggressive. He beat him. He didn't let him lose. He beat him. And he beat him even when he went to the top of list. And Yal played great. It was just a matter of, I felt like he was sending a message that I'm getting more aggressive for my return to the top of the game. And because I know I'm fast enough, but I also know in 97 degrees, I know I have a tendency to wilt out here and let things start to finish these things off. I had the ability to. I've been a

Alvin Owusu (45:27.292)
Hehehe

Torrey Hawkins (45:31.997)
counterer and now a counterpunisher and I'm fast and I know I've got decent fitness but I also know once a tournament I've been vulnerable. My points are too long. My threshold, my I'm taking a death of a thousand cuts here. So let me be able to show that I can step up and beat someone not just let them lose grind them out and then attack. Let me attack first and show that I can do that part as well. And that's what I we saw. And I think that was really what helped him. And hats off to Mehdi for a great tournament.

hats off to Yannick even more so for having a better tournament. And I really feel like Daniil who's been on the schneib a little bit, right? I mean, we were just talking about, you know, one learner team who has his number, who also had a, but it's, it felt like, it felt like Daniil was just starting to kind of exit stage left a little bit there in my opinion. And he really showed the heart of the champion and the grand slam champion he is to be continued to be relevant.

Alvin Owusu (46:12.541)
Yeah.

Torrey Hawkins (46:26.021)
And while I still feel like I had wished he had taken that volley and that time Rick Alvin, I cried when he let it go. But no, don't let it go. Take that volley. And he let it go and it was in. He was hitting himself for me, so I didn't have to. I was just, I felt, I saw the wind go out of the sails when he let that ball go. But those, it's that close, Alvin. It's that fine of margin of, you know, the wood it could have showed us that comes down to a match like that.

Alvin Owusu (46:54.714)
Yeah, I mean, there's probably two things here that I kind of want to dig into. One lightly touch on the other one to actually dig into. match, center's match against Zverev. I mean, Currier was on the call. Currier's the best. He's the best. Like he's just the best. He sees things and he can communicate those things in a way that is consumable for a wide range of tennis fans, right? His comments about Alexander Zverev.

Torrey Hawkins (47:09.169)
I love you.

Alvin Owusu (47:24.104)
where so poignant, like, I'll break it down and say, Sinner makes Zverev kind of crazy. Like, he makes him, he forces him to try things that he is not used to doing. Like, Alexander wants to back up, he wants to, there's a pace at which he wants to play. He was trying to redline from ball one, trying to throw a Porsche engine inside of a Honda Civic. Like, it's just like, you can't, you can't,

Torrey Hawkins (47:51.292)
Yeah.

Alvin Owusu (47:53.865)
play at that tempo, but Yannick forced him, made him feel like he had to play at that tempo. Like Alex couldn't even get himself into that match. that's a very, like, he.

Torrey Hawkins (47:55.323)
Yep.

Torrey Hawkins (47:59.493)
Yeah, sure.

Torrey Hawkins (48:04.251)
He's a rhythm player, isn't he? He likes getting a rhythm before he takes the ball that he feels like he wants to take. And you're not going to get that rhythm if Yannick doesn't want to give it to you.

Alvin Owusu (48:13.608)
And if you're in a rhythm, guess who else is in a rhythm? Yannick's in a rhythm. And that's a problem for you, who is in rhythm. You're in rhythm, but you're not in control. That's the issue there. Right, yeah, it's whole different song. You're in the intro, and really the drop's about to happen. Exactly. But in the mebbing of a set of things, I found myself watching this match the same way I watched the Alcaraz match.

Torrey Hawkins (48:16.576)
Anyway.

Torrey Hawkins (48:21.565)
All right.

Right, nothing is true. It's a rap rhythm for two shots before you.

Torrey Hawkins (48:32.989)
The drop's about to happen, exactly.

Alvin Owusu (48:45.4)
feeling so good about where Daniel Medvedev is right now. And you kind of saw him turn the corner, I want to say, right after the US Open, he ends up winning an event, kind of starts a little bit, a false start here and there in the indoor season, but then comes into the new year, wins the warmup event in Australian Open, comes to Australian Open place against Leroy Tien, and it's just, sometimes it's just a bad day for him. But there are some little things that are,

starting to pop up in Danil Mavvadev's game that are taking the best versions of like 2022, 2023, Danil, and I'll say 2021, 2022, Danil, and marrying it with having to like how a player evolves, right? He used to have a really big serve. His serve, I think he had a sports hernia or something like that, like in 2024, which impacted his kind of serve mechanics. It might've been 2023, but yeah.

Torrey Hawkins (49:39.773)
That'll do it.

Alvin Owusu (49:41.308)
But it seems to have worked out, he seems to have worked around it because he was serving incredibly well this week. So being able to confidently and comfortably hold service games is a big deal. He got broken one time. Like Carlos broke him one time in the semi. That's it, one time. That's a pretty big deal, right? That is a player serving and playing at a very, very high level.

Torrey Hawkins (49:48.157)
Yeah, I agree.

Torrey Hawkins (49:59.783)
Yeah.

Torrey Hawkins (50:08.05)
Yep.

Alvin Owusu (50:09.346)
We have to, we have to take into account, like, and this is something that we can, between the big three, right, and the new two, someone else did win a grand slam and was number one in the world. Dnumovidev, like he has a, he's final three grand slams in his career outside of the one that he won, right? He's won 23 tournaments. We're talking about a walking hall of famer right here. So when he comes onto the court and plays against

Torrey Hawkins (50:22.223)
Okay.

Torrey Hawkins (50:28.189)
Thank you.

Torrey Hawkins (50:34.119)
That's right.

Alvin Owusu (50:38.438)
your Alcaraz's and your-

Torrey Hawkins (50:39.453)
10 level 1000s if I'm not mistaken as well.

Alvin Owusu (50:42.926)
Yeah. And like, you know, when he comes against the Carlos Alcaraz or Yannick center, he has something that maybe only one other player in the world has. it's like, I don't care. I can beat these guys. I have beaten these guys. And if you beat me, it's not because you, you punked me when we walked on the court, it's because you played better than me today. But on my best day, I'm a problem for you. And, and what I noticed in the match against Carlos.

Torrey Hawkins (50:55.293)
All right.

Torrey Hawkins (51:05.307)
Sure.

Torrey Hawkins (51:08.828)
100%.

Alvin Owusu (51:13.436)
Danille doing the best version of the thing that bothers Carlos. And I think Novak did a really good job of it in the Australian Open 2025, forcing Carlos to hit up.

Torrey Hawkins (51:26.843)
Yep. And beat him with the backhand.

Alvin Owusu (51:28.21)
Take, right, walk me, so I'm not even gonna waste time walking through that kind of like, that progression, but like, why don't you explain what forcing a player like Carlos Alcaraz to hit up does, and almost to a point of neutralizing him to the best of one's ability.

Torrey Hawkins (51:51.005)
I talk often about rock paper scissors. I want to speak to ball trajectory. I want to speak to what Carlos likes to do. Daniel hits the flattest ball, I think, on the tour. The ball is low. The ball is big. The ball is just, it's darn near knuckle ball. There's not even much topspin on it.

Alvin Owusu (51:58.012)
Mm-hmm.

Torrey Hawkins (52:13.977)
He just nails the ball. His take back is high, his ball comes through level, and it clears the net by maybe, maybe a foot, and it lands two to five feet from the baseline and it penetrates. As a player, Carlos prides himself on variety. Variety works only when it works. If you have to hit up off the drive,

you meet with another drive. The harder you hit, the driver or the person more comfortable driving, which in this case is DeNeil, hurts you because he can do it more times than you can. How many times do we see Carlos having to slice the backhand? With the backhand slice, while it adds time, DeNeil never took the bait and went back to Carlos' forehand, which is what Carlos wanted him to do. He roped it back cross-court again.

Alvin Owusu (52:59.739)
Yeah. Yep.

Alvin Owusu (53:07.448)
Nope.

Torrey Hawkins (53:12.183)
I feel, and it's a little different, because I want to take a little bit of a tangent here and say, I don't think that Carlos tactically played him smart or took him serious enough in that match that he was a true threat. I think Carlos always feels like I'm athletic enough and I make shots enough that I'm never out of this match.

He had an on the run passing shot, Alvin, that he was beyond the scoreboard on a smack forehand cross court that was just otherworldly. And I feel like he always thinks I can always mount a rub, which is part of his secret sauce. And I love that about him. But he never fully understood, because he had a couple inside out one, inside out winners, had a couple big forehands, he kind of thought, I can get the ball I want when I want it. I still feel like that was actually, Max, that was blown by Carlos. He didn't get to task about mastering that pattern.

Can my backhand out hit yours? He's done this against Novak. He did it in 2025, it 2025 or 2024? It might have been 2024. When he went back, he went forehand big body, backhand wide, backhand body, backhand wide, then forehand. He just kept kind of thinking of the triangle and then got the ball you want with the forehand. He kept going cross with Medi and Medi's just.

played that backhand so strong to the corner that now you got Carlos trying to slice his way out of it and hoping that Medi would take the bait. Medi went forehand back line every single time. And I just feel like that's something that Carlos will have to get better as he starts to play certain players. He's got to start playing people a bit better tactically, not just freewheeling, so to speak, with guys that have known weapons. We talked about

Yannick with what's there of.

Torrey Hawkins (55:00.901)
You know Zverev wants his backhand. And so he gave my healthy dose of forehands. And yeah, you'll take that occasional winner off the forehand. But you know he won't do it consistently. And that's the same thing with Matty with Carlos. Buddy, beat me with your backhand. And don't beat me with the topspin ball that sits in your strike zone, because Carlos has a very good backhand. You know, in the world, don't have a good backhand. But he was saying, you're not going to hit that ball down the line on me when it's below your socks. And I think that's the difference with the trajectory of Medvedev's ball. And I feel like Carlos.

did not understand to take that ball more body nor did he understand enough they take him serious enough on serve to be able I thought I many served his butt off the whole tournament but in particular those last two matches he just maybe six foot five out but he's not like he's a small guy he might be six six he just he might be cranking so and Carlos is all of what six maybe so I mean you got a guy that's that's literally six feet taller with a lot more limb

Alvin Owusu (55:49.191)
6x

Alvin Owusu (55:54.609)
Six foot, yeah.

Torrey Hawkins (55:58.683)
a lot more leverage. I just feel like Carlos, in my opinion, slept on Meti a little bit thinking that he was going to kind of fall off or maybe go back to the forehand and give him some chances or he'd be fast and run around it. Never happened. And I feel that's why the match is so lopsided.

Alvin Owusu (56:12.388)
And then there's also the whole, they played one time last year when he was here at Indian Wells, And Carlos handled him, it was three and six, something like that. Yeah, but up to that point, right? No, sorry, yes, up to that point.

Torrey Hawkins (56:23.298)
Yeah.

Torrey Hawkins (56:30.909)
you

Alvin Owusu (56:32.646)
Is that right? Maybe I don't have that right. I might not have that right. It doesn't really matter. But, Daniil, think brought a little wrinkle in today's match that Carlos didn't adjust well to completely in real time. Right? So you start to look at like going back, mean, prior to today, Carlos has been, no sorry, last time they played was actually Beijing 2024. So.

Prior to today though, Carlos had had the better of that matchup. I think he won the last four in a row. So to your point about him not taking him seriously, maybe you just didn't take him seriously. Like seriously enough to.

Torrey Hawkins (57:14.301)
It looked like that and I can't remember the last time that they played. I just remember the last couple of Australians that he's been, ran in, Mehdi's ran in, that's what I keep, that's the image that's burning in my brain. But I say it to tell you, I remember certain, it's almost like he didn't realize he was caught in quicksand until he was up to his neck. You know what mean? And that's kind of, that was the look that I saw and kind of felt. But, that's taken, went from that better. Mehdi came in with a good game plan.

Carlos didn't counter it. Carlos did never, he never in that match took it serious enough to change it up so significantly enough to say, I'm gonna get you out of this pattern. You've hurt me enough with it. I think there's a little bit of the Alcara's feels like he's impervious sometimes, which is great to feel that way. Seven Grand Slams and all the accolades he's gotten will do that to you. But he just didn't realize that

that tactic hurts him. And at the end of the day, he has to find a way to hurt these bigger backhand types. Or he's gonna find himself on the losing end of that matchup, whoever that player is, and I feel like he's in a really good spot, but you can't ever feel like you've got things just handled.

You know, you've got to constantly keep working on your game and keep feeling like I think the loss actually will help him in the future Grand Slam season, rest of the Grand Slam's in the season because I that match kind of, I hope anyway, it kind of got to him a little bit to say, man, what did I not, I thought I owned that guy, you know, which is easy to think that.

And how was he able to just dismantle me? You I never handled the backhand matchup well. Not one time. You there was a few winners, few errant backhands, and went to the middle of court. But he never out hit him on the backhand side. I bet if we did Swing Vision or whatever the other, you know, play site, I bet if you said, show me all backhand to backhand matchups that more than three balls.

Torrey Hawkins (59:16.829)
Let's just say there were 25 rallies like that. I bet he won 22 to 25. If I had to guess where Alcraz did not get a forehand at the end. I bet it was 20 out of 25 at least.

Alvin Owusu (59:30.34)
Yeah, and not even just the four, not even the backhand backhand part. That's like, I wrote that down even from today's match, Mehdi versus Sinner. Mehdi's directional discipline is off the charts and you can tell that he, like he's not going to hit a ball where he should not hit a ball. Directionals for anyone who is curious is like every ball landing on your side of the court has a place where it wants to go, that it needs to be hit.

Torrey Hawkins (59:38.258)
Right.

Alvin Owusu (59:59.419)
that is the most efficient way to hit the ball back. So if someone hits a ball, yeah, and for you to cover, again, back to managing your time, right? Ball comes from deuce corner to your deuce corner, the best bet is for you to hit that ball outside directional right back to where it came from, right? You don't go line until the ball's in the middle third, yada, yada, yada, you change directions, you wanna go back cross court. It's never playing against what your body is naturally wanting to do based upon where you are on the court. Medi.

Torrey Hawkins (01:00:02.749)
and struggle.

Torrey Hawkins (01:00:15.357)
Thanks.

Thanks.

Alvin Owusu (01:00:29.218)
Rafa also, like, when you understand directionals well, you start to see why the Federer and Adal match up became so simple. Simple for Rafa, also quite simple for Fed, but in the inverse way. yeah, heavy forehand's gonna keep going to the backhand until that thing just leaves one sitting and then now you're in the lefty trap, right? The other thing that Mehdi did, the other thing that Carlos did that was a little

Torrey Hawkins (01:00:48.541)
All right.

Yep.

Alvin Owusu (01:00:58.278)
in that match was in the one game that he did break Medvedev, he started backing up on the return to serve significantly. Like I think they had the measuring tape out there, the digital measuring tape, and it ends at 18 feet and he's past it. He's back there. And in that game, that's the game he broke. But then he never did it again.

Torrey Hawkins (01:01:10.331)
Right. Right. He was beyond the Indian wealth. Right. Yup.

Torrey Hawkins (01:01:22.877)
thought he was too good to do it his own way. And ironically, my segue back to the match today, Mehdi never moved in enough to take away the out wide serve from Yannick and he burned him on it. I don't know how many times. It's just funny how pros as good as they are, sometimes they just, there's those same things that make them great. It's the thing that could make them vulnerable because they didn't change. How many times did you hear your handsome say,

Alvin Owusu (01:01:24.236)
stubborn

Alvin Owusu (01:01:43.693)
Right?

Torrey Hawkins (01:01:49.725)
Just a little more to the right cover that out wide sir I'm like exactly I'm like move up bro. Take away the darn outline So anyway, but that's good good tennis though and hey great tournament for meti made himself relevant at the for the top end of the game He's always relevant. He's grand slam champ and future Hall of Famer, but made himself relevant this tournament for the top five

Alvin Owusu (01:01:51.542)
Up, up. Make him hit a different one.

Torrey Hawkins (01:02:13.917)
And I felt for a guy that here is 2026, Manny's got a couple of kids now and married and he's closer on to retirement than he is getting started, right? So I feel like he's, but for these kind of matches and these kinds of wins, it makes you remember how good he still is. And I know I've always been a big fan of Daniel and I was very happy for him. And as far as the term he had, I'm kind of indirectly happy for Carlos because this will kind of get him to kind of wake up a little more.

tactically the things that he needs to do more of the variety that he prides himself on he needs to really double down on that and no one do it more often he did that against Novak and and I think I think the Neil is just a flatter hitting just as good of a backhand you know type of player less variety version of Novak you know and that's how he beat Novak in that in that final was he was variety backing up one heavy so those are things where you know and now I gotta say it if Juan Carlos in the box

Alvin Owusu (01:03:13.062)
No, no, we let how dare you I I don't I don't know about that because I don't know about that. I don't know. I he just That's his first loss

Torrey Hawkins (01:03:13.895)
I had to say it out. He would have made that judgment. Just saying.

Push back all you want just saying he would have known to do it. He would have known to do it I think his own stubbornness cost the match put that to the side You can push back on all you want heck of a tournament for car for Yannick Center great tournament for Matty I am looking forward to Miami now as a result I heard Novak pulled out unfortunately with some injuries to the shoulder I'm really looking forward to seeing how this can back up. It's this tournament

Indian Wells to me is always kind of a weird mixed bag because you get guys that are dinged up. got guys that makes it like last year when Jack won it. Heck of a tournament for him. He came out of nowhere in my opinion. Kind of won that tournament. And then of course he wasn't really the same the rest of the year with his own shoulder injury. And I feel like this tournament here had so many different upsides for so many different players. You know I thought Arthur Feast played great but it had a good win over you know over

My Canadian. Felix, thank you. felt like Mehdi came out of nowhere. I felt like Yao had a great match against Center. I felt like there were so many good highlights and good things to take from this tournament into the next that it's gonna really bring some neat things into Miami. And I just can't wait for Miami because all that extra, all that potential energy kind of wrapped up in.

Alvin Owusu (01:04:23.065)
Felix.

Torrey Hawkins (01:04:47.076)
and then New Wells is not only going to transfer over to the Miami Open. So I'm really looking forward to this next, the back end of the sunshine double because all that pent up potential, it's got to go somewhere. And now, again, it's going to be heck of a year for the tour this year.

Alvin Owusu (01:05:04.933)
I think that's a really good point you make about how good of an event this was. I think on both men's and women's side, maybe save for, I don't know, maybe Andrava, maybe even Iga, hell, Coco, Jesus, okay, so the men's side. Let's just stick with the men's side. I think a lot of players, only one player can win the event, but I think a lot of people come out of this extremely happy about, yeah, Carlos has had a great start to the year, right?

Torrey Hawkins (01:05:11.109)
minutes.

Torrey Hawkins (01:05:18.205)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Torrey Hawkins (01:05:29.371)
the all the better for you.

Alvin Owusu (01:05:34.04)
Won a grand slam won the next 500 got to the semi-final here lost to a player who was playing fantastic And who was a former number one and grandson champion. Okay, that's a that's a fine loss to take It's not it's not it's not David go phone 2025 Miami open right and whatever he also Carlos is fine Yannick there were a few people chirping about Yannick hasn't had the best, know last two months and okay It's good. It's good to put the naysayers down like no, no, no, I'm still I'm fine

Torrey Hawkins (01:05:36.775)
No.

Torrey Hawkins (01:05:44.272)
Still not a bad loss.

Yeah.

Torrey Hawkins (01:05:53.318)
Torrey Hawkins (01:06:01.725)
It is over. It is over.

Alvin Owusu (01:06:03.875)
I'm fine, great. Jack had a great, mean Jack's hitting that 10 match threshold now and he looks like a good version of himself. I'm happy to have him back. Arthur, you mentioned, obviously, Danil. We leave one coast, we head to the other. Things are good. Things are good. Things are good for me, because I'm gonna be in Miami. And I'm really excited about it. I'm really excited about it. It's gonna be good.

I'll let the viewers know what day I'm gonna be there as we get a little bit closer. But if you want to come say hi, that's great. But yeah, I'm excited. Let's do one more hardcore event before we switch over to the clay. I think I wanted to talk a little bit about Danil's left hand on his back hand on the throw to the racket. But not today. I think we're gonna stop. We're gonna put a pin in there. That's just Danil Medvedev in general. That's not the way you draw it up.

Torrey Hawkins (01:06:52.486)
That's not the way you draw it up, but boy is it effective.

His take back, the Paisley take back Alvin, it goes back straight, late loop, down and through with the smack. I mean, there's not much about his game that you would coaches like. But it is so effective. It is stupidly effective because of how clean of a ball he hits. They said his rackets are 360, 365, 1820, no shape, all hit. I mean, think about that, 365, 325 is a heavy racket, 330, buddy.

I think Murray had his back in the day at like 415 or 420 or something. Just a club, you know what mean? And can you imagine 365 with an 1820 with a technofiber?

Alvin Owusu (01:07:33.455)
Jesus.

Alvin Owusu (01:07:42.949)
It's a baseball bat. It's just a baseball bat.

Torrey Hawkins (01:07:44.387)
That's just what strings are around it.

Alvin Owusu (01:07:48.495)
We don't, we don't, we don't need, we don't need, we don't do spin here, guys. We don't do spin.

Torrey Hawkins (01:07:53.313)
Can you make a string that's just flat? Can you make one string and just give me a sheet and let me in through the ball?

Alvin Owusu (01:08:05.8)
my goodness. I think that's where we put a pin on it. I'm Alvin, that's Tory, best of three, we are out.

Torrey Hawkins (01:08:06.621)
You

Torrey Hawkins (01:08:13.223)
Peace.